I need to take a moral standpoint on something and i kinda like animals. I've met several recently (vegans/vegies, not animals) and not one of them've been smelly, preaching, tree-hugging cretins, they've all been really nice and if anything not keen to push their choices onto other people. I like a meat pie as much as the next person but i don't really need them, i'll probably survive if i don't eat a chicken for a while. I'm also thinking it might be a good way to drop my gut. I know three Vegans in real life and they must weigh about a stone between them. So does anyone have any advice, or any useful sites, or anything else? The veganism side looks quite complicated so i'm thinking that going vegie for the timebeing would give me time to look into it and see if it's for me and if it'd be workable. I don't want to get into the whole organic food debacle, those kind of folks usually ARE smelly preaching cretins, and i don't want to eat beans and lentils all day, or try tofu. I read something that said vegans can't eat bread because it contains whey, or drink beer or eat fruit pastilles. Is that true?
well done, would you like an award ?
or maybe a Blue Peter badge ?
maybe a bacon sandwich
I hate vegetarians who talk about being vegetarians. also this guy hasn't even decided what he wants to be, which maybe isn't the best way of going about things.
No, not at all, i'm just looking for good advice...
seeing as there seem to be several on here already i thought it might be a good place to start. COCK.
nah if you eat cock you won't be a veggie.
SHOCK and AWE
"I've met several recently (vegans/vegies, not animals) and not one of them've been smelly, preaching, tree-hugging cretins, they've all been really nice"
that is the popular perception amongst idiots, is it not?
so you're saying you're an idiot?
nope.
I think you might have been.
We should form a committee to decide.
good to see you are already practising the morally superior act
youll do just great!
^
you'd be surprised how much bad press vegans get.
Do a quick search online, it's all there.
im friends with a vegan
its not like im completely unaware of what its about. just seemed like you were quick to call people questioning you out, when in reality youve actually just decided to become a vegetarian.
Not weighing very much
ain't particularly healthy
I'm a fat fuck
who hasn't eaten meat in 24 years.
Can't be bothered to tell anyone that I don't eat meat either...so bored of being judged (instead I post about it).
To KissingK - just do whatever the fuck you think is morally right.
...
Cows are also vegetarians.Learn from their mistakes
That is where you are wrong
A lot of cows eat fish nowadays
Being vegan would be so, so depressing
I like animals AND eat them.
There is gelatine in lots of sweets
I can't imagine vegans being really healthly
but feel free to prove me wrong. I decided at Glasto to eat well and only eat veggie foods and got fucking sickness and diaherra from a feta chees eand mushroom square pie. I made a point of having a chickenburger the next day.
9/10 times I will eat a veggie dish. that 1 times always seems to be when I have to go to a McDonalds ie, only place on the road for miles!
"I can't imagine vegans being really healthly"
why?
Lack of nutrients?
like I said, feel free to prove me wrong!
hmm
i think most 'diets' are pretty poor. certainly if you know anything about meat production methods it's a fallacy to say that's really any healthier.
Vegans might find it hard to get vitamin B12
and that can be easily sorted out by quaffing Marmite.
There is no need for them to be wanting of any other "nutrient" if they eat properly.
However they will benefit from a greatly reduced risk of many kinds of cancer.
Thank you
Overall, what are the benefits of being vegan, are you healthier with dairy?
I'm a veggie
It just depends on how well you eat.
vegans can get everything they need, but it's arguably easier to get everything you need if you also eat dairy.
It's up to the person to be as healty as they want to be within the dietary rules they set themselves.
i'm told the fish eating vegetarian thing
(pescatarian?) is the healthiest culinary lifestyle choice...
Not for the fish!
they only have like 3 seconds memory or something
dont they, they wouldnt mind
I wish I could do this
but I am allergic to shellfish and been told to 'stay away' from other fish :'(
I trust you have proof the feta pie was to blame
oh no, thats right, you singled out one thing from all the many thing you ingested on that day and the previous days.
it was the only thing I had eaten for 2 days?
...apart from from jacobs crackers which I have every day and the medical tent saying they had 2 other girls in who had eaten the same as me.
But I'm probably wrong!
maybe its something to do with no eating anything for 2 days?
and drinking a fair amount of alcohol presumably?
I'm only going by what the doctor told me?
Whatever, I hate Square Pies now. I'm fickle.
????????
Eat well = eat nothing but crackers and one square pie?
you can drink most beer and lager
i think, not stella and tennants but would you miss them?
why don't you start being a vegetarian with the goal of eventually vegan. it's so hard to eat in a restaurant when you don't eat any dairy products....good luck.
I misread your username as 'kissinganus'
Good one!
i misread his username as "twee_loser"
i misread this as twaddle mer whocares?
i could quite easily prove you wrong so let's leave it there.
Good luck and enjoy the
elevated sense of self-satisfaction, sickly pallor/feebleness and the 6000% increase in flatulence.
:D
I'll flat YOUR ulence.
*trumps*
I couldn't give up meat entirely
but i'm trying to move to a less meat based diet. Ideally I'd cut out beef altogether (it just sits really heavily in my stomach and makes me feel a bit rubbish) and keep other red meats as a special occasiony thing.
My main problem is that i don't know enough veggie recipes. Various risottos and curry and that's it really.
Go veggie first
It's very easy if you have a healthy diet already, basically just stop eating meat. If you don't make your own food it may be a bit trickier.
On the subject of sweets and beer, it's not just them but many things contain a sneaky animal products. It's down to you how seriously you want to take it. I tend to avoid things with gelatine if poss but I don't care too much if I accidentally eat some and I don't bother checking which beer is animal free etc.
Beans and tofu can be quite nice so don't rule them out but the sterotype that you MUST eat them everyday is retarded.
Anything else?
Doesn't some cigerrettes contain animal products?
I remember a vegan friend telling me this.
Maybe
I don't smoke so have necer looked into it.
From a moral standpoint to be all "I want to not harm animals" and thus veggie
and then to smoke cigarettes, which effectively grinds whole sections of population in the third world into evil levels of poverty...well it's a bit fucking hypocritical.
^ Is this in the right place?
Yes it is.
I mean it's not a question of whether they contain animal products, they are highly questionable from a moral standpoint, so to indulge in cigarettes and yet choose to not eat meat for moral reasons would clearly be questionable.
I'm clearly not calling you a hypocrite because you just said you don't smoke, I was just following up on this line of debate.
Is the original poster a smoker?
I guess he must be but I was unaware. I agree with your sentiment but was unsure of why you posted it here.
cigarettes being not vegan is mentioned above
I have no idea if he is.
You seem to be reading my posts as a direct finger pointing. I'm just stating how it is, that 'vegan' tobacco or something would strike me as a very strange thing, given the politics of it all.
"which effectively grinds whole sections of population in the third world into evil levels of povert
what does this mean
I posted this a while back but here we are.
Quote from an email friends of mine sent while they were away for a year filming anti-smoking documentaries in Africa and South America:
"[we] headed up country in Uganda to meet and interview tobacco farmers. It was a pretty depressing experience. Growing tobacco is an arduous, work-intensive business which is rife with child labour. We saw first hand the dangers it poses to the farmers health and to the surrounding environment.
"As if this isn't bad enough, the companies who buy the tobacco have the farmers over a barrel. Each year they set the buying price and they decide how much of the crop they will buy. The farmers begin the year in debt to the tobacco companies because they are given loans to pay for seeds and pesticides and they are lucky if they manage to recoup enough money to break even. At the end of the harvest, the farmers have no choice but to sell to the same companies and hence are trapped in a cycle of debt and poverty.
"I really believe that no one with a conscience could continue smoking if they could see what I've seen and know the suffering tobacco causes."
Give it a go
it's really not that tough. I was a big meat-eater and I went from eating meat every day to eating none overnight.
There's plenty of recipes and other helpful stuff online, for example:
www.vegsoc.org/
Lots of "gummy" sweets have gelatine in, which is a direct animal product.
Others have ingredients that are extracted using animal products, such as whey powder.
Be prepared to read a lot of ingredients labels initially, things like Worcestor Sauce have anchovies in, which I didn't realise previously... You learn pretty quick though.
Recipes can be really easy to adapt, espcially if you use a meat substitute such as Quorn mince as this stuff generally behaves in the same way as it's meat counterpart when cooked.
Trebor strong mints: also secret meat
surprising
No way!
:O
animal products in sweets?
:OOO O ooo oo
"Yes, way!" was the correct answer.
Sorry.
gelatin, presumably?
I thought that was only in jelly sweets
hence my :O face
So, you're going to give peas a chance?
There'll probably be some gouda wheel in there too.
Oh god all these people going "Oh well done what do you want a biscuit?"
"oh i bet you feel really smug now wel done then ner ner ner"
Surely crushing cynics and dour faced cunts are worse than preachy veggies?
Anyway well done for making a choice. Be veggie first and see how it works out for you. You'll probably find out you've got more money in your pocket which you can use to buy more nice food, if you want.
Certain beer has some odd fish product in it but it's mostly only really crap beer so that's fine. Some cheeses have animal product in them (aside from milk, obviously) so they're not vegetarian.
I thin i'm gonna go vegan at a time more convinient for me but cutting out dairy as a veggie is almost as big a thing as cutting out meat as an omnivore.
i think its more just the way he went about announcing it
like sure if you want to be a veggie and ask for advice by all means do it, but when you start going on about how this choice makes you a better person than anyone else, i think its inevitable 'dour faced cunts' are going to say something?
He didn't "start going on about how this choice makes you [him] a better person"
You've over-reacted.
probably yeah
i didnt really say much though. it was more just the assumption he made that anyone who disagrees with him doesnt know what they are talking about.
'you'd be surprised how much bad press vegans get.
Do a quick search online, it's all there.'
its just asking for people to have a go isnt it?
so in conclusion
i think its fair enough if people want to do it, and i think its a good thing to do if thats what they believe, but sometimes people do invite comments like the ones yes_ disliked.
No.
The only negative thing he said is that a lot of people see vegans as being "smelly, preaching, tree-hugging cretins". He called those people idiots.
I think it's a fair thing to say that a lot of people do view vegans to be like that.
But he assumed that people who
disagree with him think that, or are idiots. and thats not true at all.
No he didn't.
He really didn't.
Well in the first place he seemed fairly suprised that vegans arent tree huggers
and assumed i knew nothing about veganism. Maybe i overreacted, i probably did, but i stand by what i said.
He just said "moral standpoint"
leaving animal welfare issues aside, I think it is morally wrong to consume meat at the leveles the West does. Wrong because it is not possible for the entire World to eat like that as there is not enough land. Wrong because intensive meat production is probably the biggest cause of pollution on Earth.
"intensive meat production is probably the biggest cause of pollution on Earth"
More so than industry?
Or heavy manufacturing?
Etc.?
It's up there near the top
and it's completely unnecessary.
The problem is that it's usually the meat eaters that have a concept
of somebody being a "better person", and so get offended by it. Most vegetarians and vegans (I would hope) realise that lifestyle politics and personal decisions are the best way to force your morals rather than preaching. Be the change you want to see in the world and all that.
This reminds me of the old days.
Yeah thats fair enough
but given that there is often a perception by some people that vegetarians and vegans do preach or try to force their moral opinion upon people (although its clearly the minority ruining it for the many), any trace of smugness or suggesting they are a better person for doing it is likely to annoy some people isnt it?
Where is the smugness though?
I think you've imagined it.
He assumed i didnt know anything about veganism
and seemed to be suggesting that people who arent vegan or vegetarian, would be, if they only had the knowledge he did.
Again, no he didn't.
He mentioned that you might not be aware of how much bad press vegans get. He did not say anything about you not knowing about veganism.
why assume that though?
just seems a bit patronising. which is kind of my point?
As a vegan.
I have encountered people having that perception of vegans an awful lot. And he didn't say that EVERYONE felt that.
You can be annoyed at him for that point, but you saying that he was suggesting you knew nothing about veganism, or was being smug is a complete over reaction.
Yeah alright
i guess im just trying to say that given the nature of the issue, and the perception that some people have of vegetarians and vegans, however illfounded, little comments like that can often make life more difficult for vegetarians etc. as it seems to be fairly provocative.